TSOT009 Pick Your Poison
Sep 25, 2019, 11:00 AM
The World Health Organization, state of California, and juries say one thing about Roundup and glyphosate. Monsanto/Bayer says another. Learn the truth.
Monsanto (/Bayer), losing three suits so far in California, with massive punitive damages, meant to deter bad corporate behavior when they act with "oppression, fraud, or malice."
In one case the jury was so convinced, they awarded TWO BILLION DOLLARS (yet the judge carried Monsanto's water and knocked it down to less than 1/20th of that).
After each case, Monsanto insists the product is utterly safe. Yet jurors were convinced of the exact opposite, through discovery papers now known as "The Monsanto Papers."
2015, The IARC, part of the World Health Organization, categorizes glyphosate as "Probably Carcinogenic to humans." But Monsanto (and now Bayer) insists otherwise.
2018, California announces it will add glyphosate to Prop 65 list. But Monsants/Bayer insists it's all wrong.
So what is the truth? "What did Monsanto know and when did they know it?" If there is anything to know.
The Scales of Truth will get you there, and discuss societal interstitials along the way.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Episode timestamped summary below:
Opening remarks / Set up
1:10 Recent lawsuits, most around Non-Hodgkins Lymphoma.
A quick survey of summary expert quotes from a trusted source.
6:07 June ‘19 WebMD article about colorectal cancer, absolutely in line with above quotes, while not acknowledging as a possible cause. Plus related commentary on narrative of article.
12:54 A farmer’s blog understates things.
14:36 Timeline of glyphosate and Roundup.
21:25 What “Punitive Damages” means. Recent adjustments by judges in line??
24:10 Health effects list
26:30 “800 studies”
27:45 Intro of a main source – SourceWatch
29:05 How glyphosate works as an herbicide (primary and secondary mechanisms)
32:09 Canada labels, to confirm what Roundup Ready really means.
33:10 Canada label recent adds - Toxic to aquatic organisms.
33:50 GMO Answers, on glyphosate levels for food from Roundup Ready crops.
36:16 Doesn’t survive food processing?? Two examples.
37:10 Herbicide increased usage stats.
41:09 HOW IT WORKS AND WHAT IT DAMAGES. Equiterre.org objects to Canada consider to renew, based on Monsanto paper revelations, studies, and other info. Monarchs and bees. Microbiomes. Birth defects in frogs and chickens at low doses. Neural defects and craniofacial malformations in humans in high-herbicide use areas (S. America). Surfactants worsen problem. Endocrine disruption in human placental cells. Affect ability to change androgen to estrogen. Severe mitochondrial damage, necrosis, and programmed cell death in embryonic and placental cells, at low doses. DNA damage in cell lines. Mammary and kidney tumors in rats.
~49:45 ASIDE: Back to farmer’s blog, and on general phenomenon of rationalizations that come along with something being connected to your livelihood.
51:05 Back to HOW IT WORKS AND WHAT IT DAMAGES.
52:00 ASIDE: What is endocrine system, and JEG-3 cells, previously mentioned.
52:28 Source strength of cited journals.
57:07 ASIDE: Revelations of knowledge, from 2002 Monsanto emails. Endocrine disruption, surfactants, endocrine damage in frogs.
1:02:08 Back to HOW IT WORKS AND WHAT IT DAMAGES.
1:03:20 ASIDE: Scientific American 2009 article citing study. Plus a bit of Rantaliciousness. Deadly to human cells, at very diluted levels. Attach proper outrage when we have enough evidence.
1:09:36 Back to Source Watch, HOW IT WORKS AND WHAT IT DAMAGES. Disruption of soil and root microbial community composition.
1:12:20 Earth Open Source article, like a journal article – ROUNDUP AND BIRTH DEFECTS: IS THE PUBLIC KEPT IN THE DARK.
1:13:38 ASIDE: Societal pattern. Point on when “science” IS “science” and when it is not.
1:16:00 Even “drift” levels of glyphosate can impact iron uptake in crops. Ill effect for crops themselves and on consumers of crops. Ill effect on crops is widely reported (chlorosis), but not yet generally associated to this cause.
1:17:14 ASIDE: Societal phenomenon - Not connecting the dots, and instead things being “mysterious” or vague. “Disorder” instead of a specific sharply-defined condition with a specific cause and effect. Parallel between crop and human “mysterious problems.”
1:18:38 2015 IARC (branch of World Health Organization) RULING – PROBABLY CARCINOGENIC TO HUMANS.
1985 EPA originally categorized as possibly carcinogenic to humans, based on a mouse study. EPA changed their mind, but still admitted if they’d used IARC statistical standards, it would have been statistically significance(!!).
1:24:20 CORRUPT PRACTICES - European Union dismissing 2010 findings of birth defects in frogs and chicken embryos at low doses, favoring old unpublished industry studies over independent Argentinian study. But Open Source said those old sources showed causation of birth defects.
1:27:16 CORRUPT PRACTICES – Health Canada's reevaluation / renewal by Pest Management Regulatory Agency based on studies skewed by bias. Studies ghost-written by Monsanto personnel. Knowledge of insufficient testing. Including admissions during testimony of ghost writing. Ignoring advice of consulting scientist.
One of goals of 20-person panel to prepare for IARC's pending negative decision - “establish public perspective on IARC.” Establish public perception??? It's the premier agency in the world dedicated to cancer research! “regulator outreach.”
1:41:05 Attempts to remove U.S. Funding for IARC. Front group formed in order to discredit. Similar to response to California labeling.
1:44:48 Source article switch, to a Mercola article.
ASIDE on censorship. Recent censorship through demotion.
1:46:48 “WHITEWASH: THE STORY OF A WEED KILLER, CANCER, AND THE CORRUPTION OF SCIENCE.”
Industrial Biotech Laboratories, hired by Monsanto, got caught for fraud. EPA declared results invalid. Monsanto refused to accept early (1980's) EPA findings of “Possibly Carcinogenic”!!
ASIDE on parallel to unwanted and failed legislation.
EPA goes against findings of their own toxicologists.
1:53:57 ASIDE “Yeah, but 'science,' and 'scientists.”
Kraven Laboratories, hired by Monsanto, caught falsifying test results.
1:55:40 MORE EMAILS. Knowledge of inadequate testing. Realizing a re-evaluation by a prestigious organization would turn out badly.
Advanced orchestration of campaign to discredit IARC.
1:59:50 “independent panel of experts” to review IARC findings, yet safety lead of Monsanto actively wrote and edited the review for them.
ASIDE: The BIG lie is the big bluff for liars. “They wouldn't lie about something THAT big!” Yes. They would. And re-emphasis of “proper outrage.”
Public record, being changed through influence, becomes what the influencers can hang their hat on.
Four-day scientific advisory panel after IARC findings, many questions raised. Industry interests remove epidemiologist over allegation he'd give more weight to independent research(!!!).
2:07:25 ASIDE on blanket reactions to “greedy lawyers.” Case-by-case is key.
2:08:42 “THIS ONE'S NUTSOID.” (no.. f'real).
EPA official believes she “should get a medal” if she can stop HHS toxic substances agency from looking into glyphosate toxicity, even as EPA co-worker says “essentially certain” it causes cancer(!!!). Warned Monsanto of IARC's ruling MONTHS ahead of announcement.
2:14:55 ASIDE: Did Monsanto ever even have to replace the leashes after all these years???
Taxpayer-paid subsidization of propaganda about safety of a product for which there is all kinds of evidence that it is unsafe(!!!)
2:16:40 MOST RECENT DEVELOPMENT: EPA going against all usual practice of allowing California to be MORE strict in its safety and environmental standards.
2:21:08 RELATED TOPICS / MISCELLANEOUS THOUGHTS
-High percentage of trials from major trial sponsors stay unpublished – So what’s there?
-2012 Study linking Roundup-Ready corn to tumors in rats. VERY Damning.
- 2:27:22 In line with the broader strategy of how to “have a study” and nearly ensure not finding anything.
-2:29:37 Sources, not particularly emphasized previously, but a fairly incomplete list.
-ASIDE on practical censorship on what was a TOP-level source to most health info consumers.
2:35:07 RELATED THREADS – mere mentions of things for you to investigate if you’re interested.
2:38:30 1947 ADVERTISING. Laughable… NOW. But showing the long-term history of massive disinfo by same company responsible for the current poisoning. Unbelievable.
2:44:26 “INSIDE THE MONSANTO BOARDROOM,” an imagining of how the current state came to be (except more sarcastic).
2:47:25 A RE-EMPHASIS on why exposure after Roundup-Ready, versus exposure before, statistically approaches infinity, even as pesticide usage does not.
In one case the jury was so convinced, they awarded TWO BILLION DOLLARS (yet the judge carried Monsanto's water and knocked it down to less than 1/20th of that).
After each case, Monsanto insists the product is utterly safe. Yet jurors were convinced of the exact opposite, through discovery papers now known as "The Monsanto Papers."
2015, The IARC, part of the World Health Organization, categorizes glyphosate as "Probably Carcinogenic to humans." But Monsanto (and now Bayer) insists otherwise.
2018, California announces it will add glyphosate to Prop 65 list. But Monsants/Bayer insists it's all wrong.
So what is the truth? "What did Monsanto know and when did they know it?" If there is anything to know.
The Scales of Truth will get you there, and discuss societal interstitials along the way.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Episode timestamped summary below:
Opening remarks / Set up
1:10 Recent lawsuits, most around Non-Hodgkins Lymphoma.
A quick survey of summary expert quotes from a trusted source.
6:07 June ‘19 WebMD article about colorectal cancer, absolutely in line with above quotes, while not acknowledging as a possible cause. Plus related commentary on narrative of article.
12:54 A farmer’s blog understates things.
14:36 Timeline of glyphosate and Roundup.
21:25 What “Punitive Damages” means. Recent adjustments by judges in line??
24:10 Health effects list
26:30 “800 studies”
27:45 Intro of a main source – SourceWatch
29:05 How glyphosate works as an herbicide (primary and secondary mechanisms)
32:09 Canada labels, to confirm what Roundup Ready really means.
33:10 Canada label recent adds - Toxic to aquatic organisms.
33:50 GMO Answers, on glyphosate levels for food from Roundup Ready crops.
36:16 Doesn’t survive food processing?? Two examples.
37:10 Herbicide increased usage stats.
41:09 HOW IT WORKS AND WHAT IT DAMAGES. Equiterre.org objects to Canada consider to renew, based on Monsanto paper revelations, studies, and other info. Monarchs and bees. Microbiomes. Birth defects in frogs and chickens at low doses. Neural defects and craniofacial malformations in humans in high-herbicide use areas (S. America). Surfactants worsen problem. Endocrine disruption in human placental cells. Affect ability to change androgen to estrogen. Severe mitochondrial damage, necrosis, and programmed cell death in embryonic and placental cells, at low doses. DNA damage in cell lines. Mammary and kidney tumors in rats.
~49:45 ASIDE: Back to farmer’s blog, and on general phenomenon of rationalizations that come along with something being connected to your livelihood.
51:05 Back to HOW IT WORKS AND WHAT IT DAMAGES.
52:00 ASIDE: What is endocrine system, and JEG-3 cells, previously mentioned.
52:28 Source strength of cited journals.
57:07 ASIDE: Revelations of knowledge, from 2002 Monsanto emails. Endocrine disruption, surfactants, endocrine damage in frogs.
1:02:08 Back to HOW IT WORKS AND WHAT IT DAMAGES.
1:03:20 ASIDE: Scientific American 2009 article citing study. Plus a bit of Rantaliciousness. Deadly to human cells, at very diluted levels. Attach proper outrage when we have enough evidence.
1:09:36 Back to Source Watch, HOW IT WORKS AND WHAT IT DAMAGES. Disruption of soil and root microbial community composition.
1:12:20 Earth Open Source article, like a journal article – ROUNDUP AND BIRTH DEFECTS: IS THE PUBLIC KEPT IN THE DARK.
1:13:38 ASIDE: Societal pattern. Point on when “science” IS “science” and when it is not.
1:16:00 Even “drift” levels of glyphosate can impact iron uptake in crops. Ill effect for crops themselves and on consumers of crops. Ill effect on crops is widely reported (chlorosis), but not yet generally associated to this cause.
1:17:14 ASIDE: Societal phenomenon - Not connecting the dots, and instead things being “mysterious” or vague. “Disorder” instead of a specific sharply-defined condition with a specific cause and effect. Parallel between crop and human “mysterious problems.”
1:18:38 2015 IARC (branch of World Health Organization) RULING – PROBABLY CARCINOGENIC TO HUMANS.
1985 EPA originally categorized as possibly carcinogenic to humans, based on a mouse study. EPA changed their mind, but still admitted if they’d used IARC statistical standards, it would have been statistically significance(!!).
1:24:20 CORRUPT PRACTICES - European Union dismissing 2010 findings of birth defects in frogs and chicken embryos at low doses, favoring old unpublished industry studies over independent Argentinian study. But Open Source said those old sources showed causation of birth defects.
1:27:16 CORRUPT PRACTICES – Health Canada's reevaluation / renewal by Pest Management Regulatory Agency based on studies skewed by bias. Studies ghost-written by Monsanto personnel. Knowledge of insufficient testing. Including admissions during testimony of ghost writing. Ignoring advice of consulting scientist.
One of goals of 20-person panel to prepare for IARC's pending negative decision - “establish public perspective on IARC.” Establish public perception??? It's the premier agency in the world dedicated to cancer research! “regulator outreach.”
1:41:05 Attempts to remove U.S. Funding for IARC. Front group formed in order to discredit. Similar to response to California labeling.
1:44:48 Source article switch, to a Mercola article.
ASIDE on censorship. Recent censorship through demotion.
1:46:48 “WHITEWASH: THE STORY OF A WEED KILLER, CANCER, AND THE CORRUPTION OF SCIENCE.”
Industrial Biotech Laboratories, hired by Monsanto, got caught for fraud. EPA declared results invalid. Monsanto refused to accept early (1980's) EPA findings of “Possibly Carcinogenic”!!
ASIDE on parallel to unwanted and failed legislation.
EPA goes against findings of their own toxicologists.
1:53:57 ASIDE “Yeah, but 'science,' and 'scientists.”
Kraven Laboratories, hired by Monsanto, caught falsifying test results.
1:55:40 MORE EMAILS. Knowledge of inadequate testing. Realizing a re-evaluation by a prestigious organization would turn out badly.
Advanced orchestration of campaign to discredit IARC.
1:59:50 “independent panel of experts” to review IARC findings, yet safety lead of Monsanto actively wrote and edited the review for them.
ASIDE: The BIG lie is the big bluff for liars. “They wouldn't lie about something THAT big!” Yes. They would. And re-emphasis of “proper outrage.”
Public record, being changed through influence, becomes what the influencers can hang their hat on.
Four-day scientific advisory panel after IARC findings, many questions raised. Industry interests remove epidemiologist over allegation he'd give more weight to independent research(!!!).
2:07:25 ASIDE on blanket reactions to “greedy lawyers.” Case-by-case is key.
2:08:42 “THIS ONE'S NUTSOID.” (no.. f'real).
EPA official believes she “should get a medal” if she can stop HHS toxic substances agency from looking into glyphosate toxicity, even as EPA co-worker says “essentially certain” it causes cancer(!!!). Warned Monsanto of IARC's ruling MONTHS ahead of announcement.
2:14:55 ASIDE: Did Monsanto ever even have to replace the leashes after all these years???
Taxpayer-paid subsidization of propaganda about safety of a product for which there is all kinds of evidence that it is unsafe(!!!)
2:16:40 MOST RECENT DEVELOPMENT: EPA going against all usual practice of allowing California to be MORE strict in its safety and environmental standards.
2:21:08 RELATED TOPICS / MISCELLANEOUS THOUGHTS
-High percentage of trials from major trial sponsors stay unpublished – So what’s there?
-2012 Study linking Roundup-Ready corn to tumors in rats. VERY Damning.
- 2:27:22 In line with the broader strategy of how to “have a study” and nearly ensure not finding anything.
-2:29:37 Sources, not particularly emphasized previously, but a fairly incomplete list.
-ASIDE on practical censorship on what was a TOP-level source to most health info consumers.
2:35:07 RELATED THREADS – mere mentions of things for you to investigate if you’re interested.
2:38:30 1947 ADVERTISING. Laughable… NOW. But showing the long-term history of massive disinfo by same company responsible for the current poisoning. Unbelievable.
2:44:26 “INSIDE THE MONSANTO BOARDROOM,” an imagining of how the current state came to be (except more sarcastic).
2:47:25 A RE-EMPHASIS on why exposure after Roundup-Ready, versus exposure before, statistically approaches infinity, even as pesticide usage does not.